Article - Is This Batman?

[ckal]

There has been an interesting development in 'Batman: The Dark Knight #2,' which I thought might be a good opportunity to speak with everyone about. Bruce may have gone a bit off the deep end. His childhood friend, Dawn Golden, had been kid napped, and Bruce was dedicated to either finding her, or to die trying to find her. "Who is Dawn Golden?" You might find yourself asking. Well, good question. She is a new character whose first appearance was in 'Batman: The Dark Knight #1.' According to Bruce and Alfred, Dawn was an old childhood friend, and seemingly former love, of Bruce's. He mentioned he hasn't thought about her in years since she broke his heart in college. Dawn has apparently since become a high profile social figure in Gotham, and has gone missing, which brings us to the issue at hand.

In order to find Dawn Golden, Bruce went on some detective work. He first started with Killer Croc, who after a brief struggle, revealed that he took Dawn and sold her to a man named Lars Beck. Well, Commissioner Gordon fills us in that Lars Beck used to work out of a place called 'The Boom Room,' but was recently found dead. Since Lars is not available for 'questioning,' Bruce goes to find some information at the Boom Room. He finds Dawn's old necklace there, but it doesn't take long before he realizes it is indeed a trap, and the Penguin and some cronies show up. Apparently, Penguin is the owner of this place and doesn't like Batman coming in and 'stealing eggs from his nest.' Bruce ends up defeating Penguin's cronies, and decides to get some information out of Penguin. Well, what ensues is a pretty brutal display of someone who is driven to achieve a goal and will do anything to get there. It seems Bruce has finally had enough, and what he does shocks everyone involved. You can even tell that the Penguin is probably used to just getting away with things with Bruce. But this time is different.



Is this Bruce Wayne? Would he, or should he do something like this? Is this a change in character for him after returning to the mantle of Batman? It is also worth calling into question his motives being so strong to find someone who he admittedly hasn't even thought of in years. Bruce is a hero, and we all know heroes act a certain way. What does Bruce and Batman stand for, and do you believe Bruce has stepped over a line in doing this, or is he justified in his actions? In what ways do you think this action might affect the future for Bruce?

This leads into another issue which I originally intended to be the topic of the next article, but depending on how this goes, it might not be needed. Are heroes too heroic? Are heroes too nice, too forgiving, and just not mean enough? Heroes tend to give villains many chances to harm people again and again, because they aren't willing to take the necessary steps to stop them for good. Well Batman has taken a bit of a departure from the typical hero mold here, but was it the right thing? His intentions are heroic and he is a hero after all, right?

YOU decide. Discuss below.

[Phantom Stargrave]

This reminds me of a scene from Dark Knight (The movie) where Batman happily lets Maroni fall down one story to the ground, causing him, IIRC, to break his leg. It didn't really seem so jarring in there.

[Lord Barbatos]

Nope ever since he came back he actually became more friendlier than ever,many people dislike Morrisons batman for that very reasons and DC decided to give them a classic milleresque batbook,but problem is that i dont think any writer throughtout the 80's and the 90's ever wrote bruce like this(and this was the era where he was most brutal),it's basically a frank miller comeback.no other writer is writing bruce like this currently,but i'll let it pass since i hate penguin.

[Beatboks]

I guess it depends on where your coming at as a Bat fan. personally I haven't been that into Batman for a couple of decades now (and thinking back I probably last collected Batman under Miller no real surprise since I loved his DD too). For example when Gangbuster first came onto the scene in the Superman books it was Bruce who taught him that you have to be prepared to cross the line occasionally for the threat to be real. The instance when that happened was the breaking of a thugs arm to get information. Of course this was during that era after year one where Bruce and Clark didn't get along because of their completely opposite methods (Clark =law, Bruce= retribution).

[Admin]

Excellent write-up. I'm going to make this article an announcement and promote it on the FB page ;D

[Lance]

Breaking a couple of bones seems light in comparison to other thoughts I'd have of someone doing if they kidnapped someone I cared about. I wouldn't expect this kind of behavior all the time, but it's a small reprieve from Sherlock Batman to a more brutal Miller feel.

[Power NeXus]

I don't have much of a problem with Batman using those methods, mainly because of the laws of the comic book world. Even major injuries never last more than a couple of issues. I can almost guarantee that the next time we see Penguin, his arms and legs are going to be as good as new.

[ckal]

Looks like most people so far are in agreement. I would like to hear more users' opinions and what someone who has a differing opinion has to say.

I'd also like to add: is this the kind of batman you want to see, or do you want to see a batman who plays it mostly (or all) by the hero book?

[InnerVenom123]

Fuck "friendly Batman". This is my kinda Dark Knight.

[creator]

After a very long period we now see a Batman that is prepared and willing to inflict serious injury in the pursuit of justice.
I don't mind this turn to a more brutal character portrayal as to me this seems like a logic step. His rogues gallery have gotten used to Batman not crossing certain lines so it has the benefit of spicing things up.

However this change makes him now more similar to Moonknight's modus operendi. Moonknight who has employed these tactics for some time now, using casual violence to more rapidly achieve justice as his detective skills were not the equal of Batman's.

[ckal]

I pretty much completely agree with you creator.

I actually find this pretty refreshing to be honest. I think his willingness to cross a line (similar to moon knight), makes the character more believable, or at least more interesting to me instead of those heroes who can be so predictable in their actions.
I also agree that it seems like a natural move forward, because as i stated above, penguin was shocked at batmans actions and you can tell he has gotten used to just getting away with things with batman, which probably applies to many other members of his rogue gallery. (This is a problem I have with a lot of other heroes and their rogues; giving them a chance to grt away and cause more harm and damage because they were unwillingto take the necessary steps to stop them.)

But with batman acting differently now, it could mean a couple changes. One, batman might continue to be more ruthless and get what he wants easier/more quickly, but maybe eventually stumble into moral territory he didn't intend to venture into, maybe not. Two, his rogues could become more brutal in return. Guess we'll see.

[Lunacyde Prime]

In my own opinion it's a slippery slope. I don't have a problem with a more brutal Batman who does what is necessary as far as inflicting some pain or breaking some bones. My problem is that in this case it's personal. It's not that he has made a conscious decision that he needs to become more brutal to be an effective crime fighter, instead it is him succumbing to his base emotions about a character which he admits he hasn't thought about in years. What kind of response would we see if it had been Alfred, Dick, or someone closer to him?

I guess I would like to see where this leads. If he continues down this slope of moral/ethical derailment I don't like it. I understand that everyone, even Batman has moments of weakness where they give in to anger or hate. However the point of Batman in my opinion is that he is controlled. He avenges, not REvenges. He is an incorruptible force of good, who despite everything he faces stands by the tenets of good he believes in.

[Crom-Cruach]

Oh look crazy Steve has stolen Bruce's stuff again.

To DC:

[ckal]

Lion- very well thought out post. I pretty much agree with everything you've said there as well. Seriously, what if we replaced dawn golden with Alfred or dick? And whos to say he stops at the penguin? Good question indeed.

[Lunacyde Prime]

It just seems like a strain to think someone never before mentioned in Batman's life. Someone he hadn't seen, talked to, or thought of in years would illicit such a response as to push him over a line he hadn't previously crossed in such a way. I just hope this isn't some excuse to make Batman more violent simply for the effect of selling more comics.

[Phantom Stargrave]

@lion - agreed. The problem isn't that Batman's brutal (Even though I don't want to see Batman like that anyway), it's that he's unhinged. Whatever line he had, he's crossed it, that's pretty obvious from his demeanor and Alfred's reaction, and Batman doesn't do that. Batman is nothing if not in control of himself. He is the quintessential stoic. He can be put through a lot of pain, but he knows how to push it down until the task is done and he knows how to maintain his composure under stress to the point of flaw.
Now seeing him go apeshit over someone we hardly know, and someone, if I get this correctly, he himself hasn't seen in years makes us cry havoc because if he's willing to do that for her, there's no telling what he would for someone he's more invested in, and that's against the core of Batman. He didn't do it when Babs was shot. He didn't do it when Jason was killed. He shouldn't do it now.

[Lunacyde Prime]

Mar 31, 2011 15:26:17 GMT -5 Phantom Stargrave said:

@lion - agreed. The problem isn't that Batman's brutal (Even though I don't want to see Batman like that anyway), it's that he's unhinged. Whatever line he had, he's crossed it, that's pretty obvious from his demeanor and Alfred's reaction, and Batman doesn't do that. Batman is nothing if not in control of himself. He is the quintessential stoic. He can be put through a lot of pain, but he knows how to push it down until the task is done and he knows how to maintain his composure under stress to the point of flaw.
Now seeing him go apeshit over someone we hardly know, and someone, if I get this correctly, he himself hasn't seen in years makes us cry havoc because if he's willing to do that for her, there's no telling what he would for someone he's more invested in, and that's against the core of Batman. He didn't do it when Babs was shot. He didn't do it when Jason was killed. He shouldn't do it now.

Perfectly expressed. I really couldn't agree more.

[spidey_17]

Mar 31, 2011 12:23:13 GMT -5 ckal said:

Looks like most people so far are in agreement. I would like to hear more users' opinions and what someone who has a differing opinion has to say.

I'd also like to add: is this the kind of batman you want to see, or do you want to see a batman who plays it mostly (or all) by the hero book?

Well, under these conditions, this is the batman i would like to see.
=]

[Erik-El]

This seems very All-Star Batman to me.

[Phantom Stargrave]

Mar 31, 2011 18:30:35 GMT -5 Erik-El said:

This seems very All-Star Batman to me.

Can't be, no one's mentioned hookers yet.