Frank Castle - Is he mentally unstable?

[Admin]

Crom and I were discussing this in the other thread. If you don't know, Frank Castle has been deteremined to kill/eliminate all criminals after the death of his children and wife by the mafia. Does his bloodlust for villains make him mentally unstable? Discuss!

[Admin]

I think before there's any miscommunication, it's important for me to know just how mentally unstable you believe Frank Castle is.

[InnerVenom123]

"You're not insane, Frank. Otherwise you would have walked into a Mcdonalds with a glock by now." ~Microchip (MAX).

[InnerVenom123]

I don't think he's insane. I think he's just really, really, really pissed and obsessed. He kills because killing is what fills him with "fierce, black joy" (Ennis said it - it must be true). If he was insane, his methods wouldn't be so clean, he'd be sloppy.

[Morpheus]

You can be insane and still be cold and calculating. The one does not necessarily negate the other.

[nelomaxwell]

Mar 14, 2011 19:56:13 GMT -5 Admin said:

Crom and I were discussing this in the other thread. If you don't know, Frank Castle has been deteremined to kill/eliminate all criminals after the death of his children and wife by the mafia. Does his bloodlust for villains make him mentally unstable? Discuss!

I personally think all costumed people are mentally unstable. I think what we should be asking is, is Frank Castle still justified in his quest?

[mavfan626]

I think he's insane but just not completely insane..

[nelomaxwell]

Mar 14, 2011 20:50:38 GMT -5 @mavfan626 said:

I think he's insane but just not completely insane..

Can't that be said for all heroes who wear costumes they do the same thing over and over again hoping for a different result. which is the dictionary definition of insanity.

[InnerVenom123]

Okay, well if you can be insane and cold/calculating, then Frank is pretty goddamn insane...

[Morpheus]

Then again, being cold and calculating does not necessitate that you're insane, either.

[Crom-Cruach]

Frank Castle is not only insane and unstable he is a serial killer with a severe god complex, albeit in a subtle way.

[InnerVenom123]

How does he have a God complex? He kills because he hates criminals.

[spidey_17]

Killing people is really not the most normal thing to do actually. I think plenty of heroes that actually kill, are not really that sane.IMO, the death of his family, made Frank a bit of insane, but i agree with Innervenom. He is mostly pissed.
=]

[Crom-Cruach]

Mar 14, 2011 21:51:14 GMT -5 InnerVenom123 said:

How does he have a God complex? He kills because he hates criminals.

Because as one of the many experts on serial killers will tell you (and I have read a few books on that. He believes himself justified, empowered and duty bound to impose his views of right and wrong on the world and destroy anyone who opposes it without any regret, he sees what he does as a holy crusade where his view is THE correct one.

His God complex comes because he believes no one is above his authority judgement or execution.

[Admin]

But that doesn't that make characters like Daredevil and Spider-Man suffer from the same thing, but on the opposite end of the spectrum? They operate outside the law and vow to bring criminals to justice in a non-fatal manner. The only difference really is Frank has no gripe with killing and see's it as a more effective option.

[spidey_17]

K4tz is right actually. What Crom described, is what makes Frank a criminal, not an insane person.
=]

[Crom-Cruach]

Mar 14, 2011 21:57:55 GMT -5 Admin said:

But that doesn't that make characters like Daredevil and Spider-Man suffer from the same thing, but on the opposite end of the spectrum? They operate outside the law and vow to bring criminals to justice in a non-fatal manner. The only difference really is Frank has no gripe with killing and see's it as a more effective option.

2 differences:
1- As a serial killer Frank Castle is driven to kill, and when his world view is challenged in a way he cannot reason away in his mind set (like when Hood resurrected his family) he breaks down (flamethrowers them)
2-Both Spider-Man and Daredevil recognize legitimate authority above them, the right to fair trial when possible. And neither of them believe themselves above right and wrong, the mores of society and the supreme authority and wisdom on what is proper justice and due process

[Admin]

1- As a serial killer Frank Castle is driven to kill, and when his world view is challenged in a way he cannot reason away in his mind set (like when Hood resurrected his family) he breaks down (flamethrowers them)

There are numerous cases where Frank opted not to kill. Be it low-life thugs who he believes have a second chance, to even Bullseye (shot him in the hand when he was down). Frank has also flat-out gone above and beyond to avoid harming heroes he respects or knows are doing what they believe to be right. As for killing his family, it's because they were brought back by the Hood, a VILLAIN who uses magic. It wasn't right and to be honest, I wouldn't trust what the Hood did either. They died awhile ago and to be brought back in that manner is disrespectful to them, especially if it means letting the Hood and his foes get a clean slate.

2-Both Spider-Man and Daredevil recognize legitimate authority above them, the right to fair trial when possible. And neither of them believe themselves above right and wrong, the mores of society and the supreme authority and wisdom on what is proper justice and due process

Frank Castle has surrendered to police officers or other forms of legal authority more times than I can count. He refuses to harm them and recognizes they have every right to do what they're doing. He believes his mission is able to accomplish what the legal system can't, and in turn save the lives of future innocents who could be killed by said villains. In that respect, he's saved a hell of a lot more lives than he's killed, and prevented countless crimes.

[NorCalCO]

I believe that he is both insane and a serial killer. When his family was murdered, something inside him snapped and he already was a skilled military combatant. I personally love his character and I believe he feels that he is justified because he is punishing what he sees as evil. The ironic thing is that his actions essentially have made him in to what he despises.

[Crom-Cruach]

Mar 14, 2011 22:08:34 GMT -5 Admin said:

There are numerous cases where Frank opted not to kill. Be it low-life thugs who he believes have a second chance, to even Bullseye (shot him in the hand when he was down).

irrelevant, he has himself aknowledged that he cannot stop killing criminals he feels a compulsion to kill them. MAX especially goes into detail about this. There is no doubt he is a serial killer.

Mar 14, 2011 22:08:34 GMT -5 Admin said:

Frank Castle has surrendered to police officers or other forms of legal authority more times than I can count. He refuses to harm them and recognizes they have every right to do what they're doing. He believes his mission is able to accomplish what the legal system can't, and in turn save the lives of future innocents who could be killed by said villains. In that respect, he's saved a hell of a lot more lives than he's killed, and prevented countless crimes.

His crusade and methods openly flaunt any authority, if he did not believe himself the ultimate authority he would capture criminals and surrender them to due process. Instead he acts like judge jury and executioner always in everything he does and feels right about it too. His views on his actions is that of a holy zealous crusade.

He is mentally unstable and he's serial killer.