Alan Scott Vs Jackie Estacado

[nelomaxwell]

Fight takes place in a pitch black NYC. In central park.

-Alan Scott is at the level he was in during JSA 54
-Jackie Is at current Level
-Morals are on
-Neither man Is blood lusted
-No BFR allowed.
-Win By KO.
-There are little to no civilians outside.
-They both start 30 feet apart.
-Neither man knows what he's up against

Who wins and Why? (Waits for Crom and Beats)

[Crom-Cruach]

Can Jackie summon shadow minions?

[nelomaxwell]

Yes he can.

[Crom-Cruach]

Then he could essentially summon a endless supply of godzilla sized chtullu shadow spawn and go apeshit on Scott's ass.

Thought I haven't read JSA 54 so I'm not sure how strong Scott is at this point. Scott's highest feats would have no problem with those.

[nelomaxwell]

I think Alan is at his lowest showing where he can give Jackie a good fight. I didn't read the whole arc so we'll have to wait for Beat Boks to rebut.

[Beatboks]

@nelo I may not have been clear on the period to take Alan from. I meant pre issue 54 (before he faced D'arken) post teh JLA/JSA crossover of Darkest Night. Arguably the one feat he has in 54 itself showed him back at peak levels.

I'm just going to get a few scans loaded on CV from those issues to link ( and demonstrate the lower levels he was at) before I make an actual comment. Just to make it a little easier to actually have a discussion. Hopefully (if I've got my fav comics in their normal order ) I should be back soon.

[Beatboks]

Here are those scans to sow why he's lower and no where near peak in that period.

Here Alan explains to Todd how he has to keep a high level of will power to contain the starheart for the protection of all.

www.comicvine.com/myvine/beatboks1/all-images/108-52364/alan_has_to_focus_to_contain_the_starheart_/105-2338432/

www.comicvine.com/myvine/beatboks1/all-images/108-52364/alan_explains_his__contol_problems_to_scot/105-2338431/

www.comicvine.com/myvine/beatboks1/all-images/108-52364/alan_and_todd_2/105-2338429/

It goes on in following pages to say how after the transformation the pixies will attack Vampires resulting in every hero being on one side of or the other and a war that will destroy everything. So Alan has to limit his use of the power and keep a high percentage of his will focused on containing it. meaning he can't actually commit fully to a battle since he's involved in a battle of will 24/7 to retain control over the entity that is his power.

Because of this limiting of his focus he is suddenly susceptible to physical injury like he never has been before. His neck is broken in a physical combat. Breaking the neck of a being who is supposed to be living mystical energy manifesting itself as how it sees itself is a real talent IMO.

www.comicvine.com/myvine/beatboks1/all-images/108-52364/alan_s_neck_broken_easily_/105-2338433/

After this when he tries to transport himself to his citadel (a base of power for him) he almost looses control of the starheart from simply teleporting himself to the moon.

www.comicvine.com/myvine/beatboks1/alan-scot/108-545115/alan_almost_looses_control_of_the_starheart_after_pushing_himslef_too_far/105-2338428/

He's so limited he's unable to actually heal himself from being paralyzed. I mean a guy who could grow back a gouged out eye at a thought can't heal??

www.comicvine.com/myvine/beatboks1/all-images/108-52364/alan_can_t_even_heal_himslef_from_an_injury/105-2338430/

I hate (obviously being the biggest Alan Scot fanboy in the universe) this whole run. That's why I refer to Guggenheim as a hack (and think he should go back to writing for Law and Order shows). I mean in the same run he depicts Jay in his prime as a man who in WWII was prepared to kill an infant because he was ordered to, and fights Alan when they come to odds over this.

Anyhow. In this fight it's still one that Jackie has to in my opinion work for, but because of the "dark nature" side of the star heart a fight he can definitely win. The obvious argument that could be offered for Alan is that since his power by many is considered to be light in nature it would counter any construct of Jackies. However since that light has an element of darkness that is also a part of it there would be some level of symbiosis that would allow (IMO) Jackies shadow constructs to interact with Alan's constructs.

The fact that Alan is more susceptible to physical damage also plays to Jackie's enhanced stats.

Hate to say it, but that version of Alan would likely go down to Jackie after a hard fight.

[nelomaxwell]

Thanks for the info beats.

[Crom-Cruach]

How strong is that version of Scott against giant monsters of the Godzilla class in destructive abilities?

[Killshot Caine]

I think Alan would curbstomp Jackie.

[Beatboks]

May 11, 2012 20:51:18 GMT -5 Crom-Cruach said:

How strong is that version of Scott against giant monsters of the Godzilla class in destructive abilities?

Let's put it this way, he was made a cripple by a character who First Wildcat (admittedly by driving a truck into him) and then Lightning (Black Lightning's daughter) put's down.

[Beatboks]

May 11, 2012 22:04:36 GMT -5 Killshot Caine said:

I think Alan would curbstomp Jackie.

Against a normal Alan at the peak of his powers I'd whole heartedly agree. Against the nerfed Guggenheim (DC EVER let him near a fav character of mine again and I'm going postal) there is a fight.

[Crom-Cruach]

Then all Jakie has to do really is god hog wild with the darkling summoning to keep Scott busy, then use interior explosion trick.

[Beatboks]

May 12, 2012 10:36:23 GMT -5 Crom-Cruach said:

Then all Jakie has to do really is god hog wild with the darkling summoning to keep Scott busy, then use interior explosion trick.

HMMM why am I helping people make battles that potentially get my favorite character in all of comicdom smited

*goes off to get head examined*

[Crom-Cruach]

lol

[DedmanWalkin]

Isn't a Green Lantern a good counter to the Darkness? Their power is creating incredibly bright light, shouldn't that weaken him?

[Crom-Cruach]

Well considered Jackie's foe is the avatar embodiement of the concept of light. It takes a certain Oomph to be effective against him

[DedmanWalkin]

Alan Scott is the most powerful of Green Lantern's so he should have some level of oomph.

[Crom-Cruach]

true but I'm basing my comments on Beatbok's assessment I'm honestly not familiar with this incarnation of Scott.

[Beatboks]

May 15, 2012 0:04:21 GMT -5 DedmanWalkin said:

Alan Scott is the most powerful of Green Lantern's so he should have some level of oomph.

During the Guggnebhiem (Hack) run on JSA he made repeated reference to the "darker side" of the starheart energy. So aside from being the light it's also got an element of darkness to it. This was also played on during the JLA story with Eclipso where he using his control over Shade effectively gained control over the starheart.

So yes Alan is the most powerful but during this run by possibly the worst writer to ever grace a comic book page with his work (at least NO RESPECT for anything that had come before) he was pretty much neutered. He couldn't even heal himself, had to create a construct to make his body work, would loose control over his own power from simply teleporting to the moon (wow that was strain full )