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Post by Crom-Cruach on Dec 13, 2010 22:11:48 GMT -5
@crom: And again, the whole universe being built on that it does not make it part of Pete's character. Not at all. Try to think what Pete has done all these years and you will realize how much peace of crap it was and how much out of character was that. It was a piece of crap, it still is. But it's a peace of crap the writers are with every work of writing since making in-character. @soldier: Ughh..... And again having one of the most important people of your life being in hospital because of a stupid move that you did during a stupid registration and then having the chance to solve that and at the same time having your wife trying to convince you to do it..... Seriously, i hate when people blame Peter so much for that. No offence for anyone, but it's stupid....-___- No, it is right to blame Peter, to scorn and to look with disgust. There is no excuse for what he did, ever. He made a deal with Satan that gave him free reign to thinker with reality to his whim. He placed his selfish desires over the lives and souls of everything that exists, just because he wouldn't grow a pair and take it like a man. There is no excuse for that. |
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Post by masterprime64 on Dec 13, 2010 22:14:24 GMT -5
exacly
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spidey_17
The Unstoppable Ledgernaut
With Great Power Comes Great.... suffering?
Posts: 4,961
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Post by spidey_17 on Dec 13, 2010 22:22:05 GMT -5
No, it's not in character and i still don't understand how can you believe that. OK, you calling a "normal" human selfish like he is the only selfish person in the world. Then you have this " selfish " person, more than a million of times, risking his life for people who in the end will be hating on him and nothing more. This selfish person have shown to be responsible from the age of 15, having people mocking him, having no friends, having his aunt in hospital and at the same time needing to find a cure for that. Also, having the chance to beat someone but he did not do that because if he would, many lives would be lost and in the end spider-man got his ass beaten because....he is selfish?  Seriously now, the only one who has to blame is Queasada and not some one who has shown more than once that he is something completely opposite of selfish...... =] |
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Post by masterprime64 on Dec 13, 2010 22:27:49 GMT -5
Don't get me wrong I would do anything Humanly posible to save someone I love, but I would never make a deal with a demon to achive it. If Aunt May had to die, then it was her time.
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InnerVenom123
Team Buster Ledger
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Post by InnerVenom123 on Dec 13, 2010 22:31:31 GMT -5
Peter's always had a guilt problem... and it kinda got out of control since his Aunt's condition was his fault by all means.
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Post by masterprime64 on Dec 13, 2010 22:33:00 GMT -5
he's a...whatever
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spidey_17
The Unstoppable Ledgernaut
With Great Power Comes Great.... suffering?
Posts: 4,961
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Post by spidey_17 on Dec 13, 2010 22:33:32 GMT -5
I don't get you wrong. I just hate when people blame Peter for making that deal when the only responsible is Queasada.
Spidey has not changed at all after BND. He has been the same awesome Pete who still protects people and uses his powers responsibly.
So i don't understand why people somehow like pre OMD Pete but they dislike post OMD Pete....
=]
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Post by Crom-Cruach on Dec 13, 2010 22:35:29 GMT -5
No, it's not in character and i still don't understand how can you believe that. Because every writer, editor and story since then is making it in-character. it's seeped in and changing marvel. It's not an isolated WTF incident, it's the spring-board for all canon that follows. Hell they even published a special document to get writers up to date recently that explained OMD to get them to know why things are where they are after Grim Hunt. OK, you calling a "normal" human selfish like he is the only selfish person in the world. The presence of other selfish people in a world does not alleviate the selfishness of an individual's acts. quot; person, more than a million of times, risking his life for people who in the end will be hating on him and nothing more. This selfish person have shown to be responsible from the age of 15, having people mocking him, having no friends, having his aunt in hospital and at the same time needing to find a cure for that. Also, having the chance to beat someone but he did not do that because if he would, many lives would be lost and in the end spider-man got his ass beaten because....he is selfish? He handed over the fate of the entire Marvel Universe to Mephisto just to satisfy his own desires and needs. That is the definition of solipsistic selfishness. And it is evil on a scale that makes any further heroic action meaningless. As to blaming only Quesada. At first we could, not anymore. Because everyone is on board with it. If the writers had fought it, written letters to fan telling them they don't want it and fought this change instead of helping it settle in. Then we could blame only Quesada. Not anymore, by enabling him, they are party to his gross actions. |
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Post by masterprime64 on Dec 13, 2010 22:37:41 GMT -5
Indeed
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Post by Gender on Dec 13, 2010 22:43:52 GMT -5
This arguments lack Quesada lawls.  Attachments:
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Post by Crom-Cruach on Dec 13, 2010 22:44:48 GMT -5
@data: LOOOOOL.
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Post by masterprime64 on Dec 13, 2010 22:45:48 GMT -5
Epic
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spidey_17
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With Great Power Comes Great.... suffering?
Posts: 4,961
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Post by spidey_17 on Dec 13, 2010 22:49:06 GMT -5
@crom: No writer or editor make this in character. They base events on that, but that does not make it in character in every way....
Seriously now. In character would be, if Pete has shown that personality constantly. He didn't.
Peter blaming himself for Uncle's Ben death. Then having his aunt dying because...of him....again.
Then having a person to help him solve that and at the same time having his wife trying to convince him to accept the deal. Peter having ALL these in mind and the only thing that he wanted was his aunt May back and his secret identity being secret again.
I don't see anything evil on that. It's selfish and out of character but not on the level that makes him look bad or something. You have to understand that. He was almost beyond his limits. Maybe Mephisto was planning something bad, but not Pete. Seriously now.
OK, instead of blaming only Queasada, blame all the writers. What's the difference?
Again nothing of that should be blamed on Pete. Everyone knows that it was out of character.
=]
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spidey_17
The Unstoppable Ledgernaut
With Great Power Comes Great.... suffering?
Posts: 4,961
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Post by spidey_17 on Dec 13, 2010 22:49:51 GMT -5
ROFL
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Post by Crom-Cruach on Dec 13, 2010 22:57:13 GMT -5
@crom: No writer or editor make this in character. They base events on that, but that does not make it in character in every way.... Seriously now. In character would be, if Pete has shown that personality constantly. He didn't. No, it's becoming in-character because everyone who has power to decide what is in-character for Peter is making this move in character. And doing nothing to show us that it wasn't. Peter blaming himself for Uncle's Ben death. Then having his aunt dying because...of him....again. Then having a person to help him solve that and at the same time having his wife trying to convince him to accept the deal. Peter having ALL these in mind and the only thing that he wanted was his aunt May back and his secret identity being secret again. The person offering him is the devil and even told him how he would do it. Evil personified was offering to satisfy his desires. There is no wiggling out of that. I don't see anything evil on that. It's selfish and out of character but not on the level that makes him look bad or something.] You don't see how handing the key to reality to Satan is evil  OK, instead of blaming only Queasada, blame all the writers. What's the difference? We must blame everyone at Marvel, Quesada for making it happen, everyone who helped him, and everyone who stood by and let it happen. Again nothing of that should be blamed on Pete. Everyone knows that it was out of character. =] When it happened it was a WTF out-of-character moment, but if you keep writing everything in your character's world to make it not out of character, there comes a point when it isn't anymore. No matter how bad it is for the character. What OMD is now is proof. That inside, in the dark when everything is loss and pain. He will sell his soul for succor. |
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InnerVenom123
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Post by InnerVenom123 on Dec 13, 2010 23:35:35 GMT -5
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Post by Crom-Cruach on Dec 13, 2010 23:37:15 GMT -5
lol.
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spidey_17
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Post by spidey_17 on Dec 13, 2010 23:39:30 GMT -5
That does not make any sense.
Just because they use that event to built marvel universe it does not mean that it becomes part of Pete's personality.
Being the devil it was the reason that this was out of character. If it was for anyone else( good ) then it would be in character.
No i don't see it. The reason that Pete gave him the "key" is because he wanted his aunt back and his identity to be secret. Pete saw nothing evil in that even though mephisto might planned something evil.
Actually, it would be something strange to see such a huge event being end in a few issues. That's why writers might didn't fight it. That's how they think.
And again it makes no sense. They don't write anything to make it seem in character. They just base a few things on that event but in no way makes that in character.
=]
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Post by Crom-Cruach on Dec 13, 2010 23:46:58 GMT -5
That does not make any sense. Just because they use that event to built marvel universe it does not mean that it becomes part of Pete's personality. It slowly is becoming his personality, because in-story they acknowledge it happened, have the characters around him know it happened and are doing everything they can to justify it. There is a point of no return. Peter is slowly getting there. No i don't see it. The reason that Pete gave him the "key" is because he wanted his aunt back and his identity to be secret. Pete saw nothing evil in that even though mephisto might planned something evil. He's the FUCKING DEVIL! Any additional power over the lives of others you give him is evil. That is all. It doesn't matter why he did it, what matters is he gave evil free reign to thinker with reality and thus allowed him to use his evil power on billions of innocent souls as he pleases, all for his selfish whims. Actually, it would be something strange to see such a huge event being end in a few issues. That's why writers might didn't fight it. That's how they think. They could have rewritten things after to change it, make sense, show he was mind-controlled some shit not to stain him. Instead they are making this change more and more solid and established. And again it makes no sense. They don't write anything to make it seem in character. They just base a few things on that event but in no way makes that in character. =] They are doing everything in their power to make it in character, that much is true. |
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spidey_17
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Post by spidey_17 on Dec 14, 2010 6:27:08 GMT -5
This does not mean much. It's out of character. People acknowledge that it happened but this does not make it in character. Quesada just created his own character in that even. He ignore spidey's morals and what he has done for so many years. It's just out of character.
Spidey was not aware of anything like that. Even he stated that he did not understand how these things would work. So it will be hard to imagine that Mephisto would gain evil powers over other lives.....
Also, no offence, you are acting like Quessada. You are ignoring what Pete has done all these years and you keep calling him selfish? Especially when he made an out of character choice that it was under specific circumstances.
I really don't care about this. I blame writers and especially Queassada. Pete is not even close to being responsible for anything that happened in OMD.
If by saving million of lives by a bomb and stuff like that is how they will make OMD part of Pete's personality then they failed. Seriously now, both of us know how stupid that was it and nothing can make it part of Pete's character.
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